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  1. #1
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    NOK-13 needs to change

    I recently got this failure from Sogeti:

    “I have just seen that when installing the application on a device in English and changing the application to Spanish, the application language is not changed, however, when installing the application on a device neither in English nor in Spanish user is prompted to choose the language and if she/he chooses Spanish, the application is actually in Spanish. Then, since this behaviour is not in line with NOK-13 test case of Nokia Test Criteria, please send me an updated waiver for the one that is attached to this message, with different Functional Justification if needed.”

    There are two main ways to do localization.

    1. To load different resources on application startup. This is good because you can change the language dynamically, but bad because you have other language resource files cluttering up the phone memory.

    2. The other way is to install different resource files at installation. This is good because the extra files are not installed.

    For the non English/Spanish phone, it is the app installer's choice to show the dialog, nothing to do with our app.

    Why would a Spanish user want an English version of the app? NOK-13 is saying that the second method now not allowed by Nokia (it has always been allowed before and is still allowed by other handset manufacturers). The Symbian SDK says the method we have used is the more typical choice. From http://www.symbian.com/developer/tec...2eLocalisation the sdk says

    "More typically than installing all the resource files for all the available locales, you would only want to select a single resource file for installation, based on the system locale or user preference. The Symbian OS Installation System enables this, as described in ‘How to create an installation file for a multilingual application.’ "

    So, this means NOK-13 is in contradiction to the OS design guidelines. We have used the OS preferred method of localization.

    NOK-13 should be re-written/removed or the SDK should be changed to suggest the more resource hungry method should be used.

    Until this is done we need a waiver to cover this.

    More pointless paperwork! I understand the motivation behind most of the things that go on with Symbian signed (even if they are not in my best interests), but this is another example of a lack of common sense that seems to benefit nobody. Can anybody shed any light on this?

  2. #2
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    Well, to unrant a little, just got this update from Nokia Testing:

    “A very good point. The customer's rationale is sound and, in my opinion, best practise on how to install language packs.

    This issue is ok. And I think it does not need a waiver, it can be handled as an exception from now on (we will update this to the test criteria with a next major update).”

    Looks like there may be some sense creeping into the system. I wonder what other aspects we can change...

  3. #3
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    I still think that the option 1 is better, and infact it is even better if one would allow user to select which language files are installed into the phone. Like my file manager, you can have it installed even with a language that the phone it is installed does not have, which is important to some users indeed.

  4. #4
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    I sort of agree with you. I am not particularly defending option one or two. I chose two because in the lack of any specific customer requirement in this area it is ever so slightly easier to do than option one.

    With your "even better" solution, you would have failed NOK-13 according to Sogeti (they might have missed it with your app. It depends on the day. ). If you advertised 8 languages, the user installed 3, and then changed the phone to one of the ones you didn't install; the phone would have failed to start in the correct language "the application language is not changed". So, you would have failed/needed a waiver.

    Still, they are making it an exception now, so no worries this time.

    What really does worry me is that the wrong things often seem to be policed with Symbian signed.

    I also think the trust relationship is wrong. It is all set up to allow you to trust the code/sis file (which you can't trust really, because no amount of testing will reveal a well hidden Trojan). If I had created this system, I would have set the trust relationship between the user and the organization the produced the code. Unless Symbian Signed has the source (and they did discuss this at one point) then you have to trust the developers. Why pretend anything else?

  5. #5
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    Hi all,

    Just to precise this point:
    "If you advertised 8 languages, the user installed 3, and then changed the phone to one of the ones you didn't install; the phone would have failed to start in the correct language "the application language is not changed". So, you would have failed/needed a waiver."
    In such a case it will not fail because the test case needs that:
    1. Start the application.
    2. Check that the application uses the device language if available. If the application does not have such a language, it will use the default language, which usually is English.
    3. Change the device language.
    4. Start the application.
    5. Check that the application uses the device language or the default language.
    6. Repeat the test beginning from step 3 until all languages have been tested. Usually the tests need to be done with 2-3 devices with different language packages.

    Then here is the example of what should do an application with two languages (for example English and French) assuming that the default language is French to pass the NOK-13 test case:
    • Configure the device language to English.
    • Install the application: it should start in English.
    • Change the device language to French.
    • After the device has rebooted start the application: it should be in French.
    • Change the device language to a language not supported by the application, for example Italian.
    • After the device has rebooted start the application: it should be in French (the default language).

    I hope it is more clear for all of how the application should behave to pass the NOK-13 test case.

    Edit: of course as there are new instructions from Nokia Testing, any developer can use the second method described by Nigel Brown.

    Best regards,
    Antoine POULAT from Sogeti.
    Last edited by Sogeti; 2008-01-15 at 10:30.

  6. #6
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    So, if the user can install English and French and only chooses to install French, when the user switches the phone from French to English the app fails NOK-13 becasue English was never installed.
    So, I think you are argeeing with me that the "even better" solution proposed by symbianyucca will fail. (Even though it is the best of all worlds and the best thing for the user)

    Hence the title of the original post.

  7. #7
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    Hi Nigel,

    • The solution proposed by symbianyucca will not fail, let see an example of an application like symbianyucca described:
      The application supports for example English, French, Italian and Spanish languages.
      At the installation user is prompted with checkbox which language it wants to install (even if the device is in a supported language). Lets assume user selects only French. Then even if application can support also English, Italian and Spanish, as it is the user choice to install only in French, then the application passes the NOK-13 test case.
      Why do you think in this case NOK-13 test case fails?

    • On the other hand, there is the default Symbian Installer way where all language packs should be installed and when user changes the device language to a supported one, the application language should change accordingly. And if user changes to a non-supported language, application should selects the default language.

    Best regards,
    Antoine POULAT from Sogeti.

  8. #8
    Nokia Developer Expert
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    Hi,

    Quote Originally Posted by nigel.brown View Post
    So, if the user can install English and French and only chooses to install French, when the user switches the phone from French to English the app fails NOK-13 becasue English was never installed.
    This will not fail in the tests. This will be handled as an exception as the whole test case is not valid in the case the user installs only a single language.

    The original purpose behind the NOK-13 case is to root out problems such as if device language is changed from English to French, but the application language changes from English to Italian. We will update the test criteria to state the exception for only installing one language.



    -aa

  9. #9
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    Point 2 first:
    • On the other hand, there is the default Symbian Installer way where all language packs should be installed …

    This is not the default way as per the Symbian documentation. You already conceded this point below and this is why we have this as an exception. The default way is to do it the way we did. The installer makes the choice at install time based on the languages supported in the pkg file(whether it is bettor or not is another matter).
    If what you are saying is true, that all languages should be installed at each installation, what is the point of the mechanism in the pkg/sis files that allows the installation of different files based on the language chosen during installation?
    This is why I suggested that NOK-13 needs to change. It is not in line with the Symbian SDK. The fact that NOK-13 requires an exception suggests that it wasn’t written to cover all valid apps.
    Or maybe the approach suggested in the Symbian SDK is no longer valid, in which case some clarification is required.

    • The solution proposed by symbianyucca will not fail …Why do you think in this case NOK-13 test case fails?

    I don’t think it should fail based on the criterion. I just said I though it would based on the fact that you initially failed our implementation.
    In the implementation you failed us on the choice is made at installation, just as symbianyucca’s. The only difference is that you can only select one language. The Nokia handset makes the choice for you based on the currently selected language. On a UIQ handset the user is presented with a dialog asking the user which language to install. This is a better system because the user might know any 2 languages (one of which might not be the default). The phone might not get it right.
    I can’t see the difference, from the point of view of testing NOK-13, between symbianucca’s “better solution” and ours.
    Both will not switch to the correct language when that language is not installed.
    The reason the language is not installed is under user control, except where the Nokia handset takes the choice away by selecting the default language.

  10. #10
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    Re: NOK-13 needs to change

    Now that makes sense. Thanks.

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