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  1. #1
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    Licensing (Again)

    Hi All,

    Sorry to ask - I have read many many posts on reg key licensing, and I'm sure you all have too, but almost all of them were 8+ months ago and much of the discussion is focussed on DRM which as we know is irrelevant in protecting our apps from being re-posted elsewhere after a PC download.

    What is the current status with using your own registration keys - like a call out to your own license server for a first time activation?

    I want to sell a full version, but one that needs to be activated to work completely. On first execution after installation, the app would do a simple HTTP POST to my license server sending up the IMSI and IMEI. The server would respond with an activation code which would be saved in the apps /private directory.

    So the user doesn't have to enter anything, just allow a single first time only internet connection to the license server.

    Can we do this yet, or is this still at the "Nokia is working on it" stage?

    TIA

    Sam

  2. #2
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    IMHO it still doesn't work as you dont get notified of the individual sales.

    P.S. I am doing only Symbian native apps, and havent had piracy problems so far. This seems to be a sideeffect of the Express Signed
    The lines above are the best I have to offer.If anyone of you is of more advanced knowledge, I ask for your patience and understanding! - unknown arab poet
    http://www.tamoggemon.com - Symbian blog - Windows Phone blog
    My other blogs:
    webOS blog iPhone blog BlackBerry blog Samsung bada blog Android blog

  3. #3
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Quote Originally Posted by tamhanna View Post
    This seems to be a sideeffect of the Express Signed
    Actually, it is not related to the Express Signed itself, but to the OMA 1.0 DRM Forward Lock protection...

    Marco.
    http://www.guardian-mobile.com/

  4. #4
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Thank you both.

    I've seen some posts here saying that you can't sell a locked app on Ovi.

    So ignoring the DRM 1.0 issue for a moment, the real question becomes - will Ovi/Nokia *let* me do this?

    The other approach I could take is to have it fully functional, but have annoying messages reminding the user to activate. I don't like this because software should not annoy people as a rule.

    How are you guys dealing with this issue at the moment?

    Thanks

    Sam

  5. #5
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Actually, at current time, I've a publisher account but I didn't published anything yet, because it would damage the others distribuition channels I already use for my apps.
    I'll publish my apps on OviStore ONLY if Nokia will add support for a more secure protection, because I want guarantees that others distribution channels will not be damaged by the OviStore insecurity.

    I wish we could have something like the blackberry solution:
    http://na.blackberry.com/eng/develop...cense_Flow.pdf
    it's very smart and flexible.

    I don't mean it should totally replace the DRM FL
    I would be happy also if Nokia will provide it as an option, side-by-side the current DRM FL, so developers will be able to choose between the fast-and-easy DRM FL protection, or the more secure Dynamic License Flow.

    Marco.
    Last edited by ilsocio; 2010-05-03 at 14:46.
    http://www.guardian-mobile.com/

  6. #6
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Quote Originally Posted by ilsocio View Post
    Actually, it is not related to the Express Signed itself, but to the OMA 1.0 DRM Forward Lock protection...

    Marco.
    Hi,
    the strange thing is why the OMA DRM doesnt protect J2ME files then - these get stolen off the Ovi Store in record time!
    The lines above are the best I have to offer.If anyone of you is of more advanced knowledge, I ask for your patience and understanding! - unknown arab poet
    http://www.tamoggemon.com - Symbian blog - Windows Phone blog
    My other blogs:
    webOS blog iPhone blog BlackBerry blog Samsung bada blog Android blog

  7. #7
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Quote Originally Posted by tamhanna View Post
    Hi,
    the strange thing is why the OMA DRM doesnt protect J2ME files then - these get stolen off the Ovi Store in record time!
    Because OMA DRM v1 is not really much of a protection system; weak encyrption, easy to crack/bypass and originally intended for low-value items such as wallpapers and ringtones for mobile phones where there's no high-level OS that allows access to the content via installable apps and/or the file system.

    OMA DRM V2 (esp. with separate delivery) is better, but not crack-proof, either.

  8. #8
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Hi Petrib,
    yes, ok - but then why weren't my Symbian Native apps attacked so far?

    Tam
    The lines above are the best I have to offer.If anyone of you is of more advanced knowledge, I ask for your patience and understanding! - unknown arab poet
    http://www.tamoggemon.com - Symbian blog - Windows Phone blog
    My other blogs:
    webOS blog iPhone blog BlackBerry blog Samsung bada blog Android blog

  9. #9
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Quote Originally Posted by tamhanna View Post
    Hi Petrib,
    yes, ok - but then why weren't my Symbian Native apps attacked so far?

    Tam
    Tam, you were just lucky, or maybe your apps weren't so much interesting.
    It is pretty easy to remove the DRM wrapper from any apps, no matter if it is native or not.

    You can find some more informations on this thread:
    http://discussion.forum.nokia.com/fo...d.php?t=168939

    Marco.
    http://www.guardian-mobile.com/

  10. #10
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Quote Originally Posted by ilsocio View Post
    Tam, you were just lucky, or maybe your apps weren't so much interesting.
    It is pretty easy to remove the DRM wrapper from any apps, no matter if it is native or not.

    You can find some more informations on this thread:
    http://discussion.forum.nokia.com/fo...d.php?t=168939

    Marco.
    Marco is correct and we are the latest victim of flawed security provided by Ovi Store. We published native symbian application which has been hacked. It was hacked within days after uploading.

    Our content were very unique and no other publisher offers similar content. Our application was so called "interesting" for the group we targeted.

    We were naive to take security issues lightly. We found many other applications going through Ovi channel e.g. KillerMobile Apps (which previously had activation code for all its apps) so we thought security is not that bad and went ahead with our content.

    Our application not only got hacked but uploaded to many websites. Even after month we are not able to get it removed from rogue websites. Ovi Store was not much help in getting them removed outside Ovi Store. The reason "Ovi doesn't have intellecutal property rights of our content and it's up to publisher to get them removed".

    Adarsh Mobile Applications
    www.adarshapps.com

  11. #11
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    Hi,
    the thing is: one it hits ONE site, it gets spread to all others.

    So it seems that there is one or two guys who buy the app, and then spread it around. If they dislike the app, they are safe.
    The lines above are the best I have to offer.If anyone of you is of more advanced knowledge, I ask for your patience and understanding! - unknown arab poet
    http://www.tamoggemon.com - Symbian blog - Windows Phone blog
    My other blogs:
    webOS blog iPhone blog BlackBerry blog Samsung bada blog Android blog

  12. #12
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    Lightbulb Re: Licensing (Again)

    Quote Originally Posted by sachin_upadhyay View Post
    Marco is correct and we are the latest victim of flawed security provided by Ovi Store. We published native symbian application which has been hacked. It was hacked within days after uploading.

    Our content were very unique and no other publisher offers similar content. Our application was so called "interesting" for the group we targeted.

    We were naive to take security issues lightly. We found many other applications going through Ovi channel e.g. KillerMobile Apps (which previously had activation code for all its apps) so we thought security is not that bad and went ahead with our content.

    Our application not only got hacked but uploaded to many websites. Even after month we are not able to get it removed from rogue websites. Ovi Store was not much help in getting them removed outside Ovi Store. The reason "Ovi doesn't have intellecutal property rights of our content and it's up to publisher to get them removed".

    Adarsh Mobile Applications
    www.adarshapps.com
    I understand you problem. I am in same situation.
    But
    In every review of my application there was at least one user that post link to rapidshare(like service) with my application.
    In every review!!!
    How many users will relay buy my application in this situation

    Ovi store should provide some kind of DRM ( not stupid OMA DRM ) but there is better solution.
    OVI STORE should provide API that we can check that user really buy our content and after that we will activate application as full version.

  13. #13
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    Angry Re: Licensing (Again)

    We published "Ninja Joe" to Ovi and after 4 weeks it was pirated and available in 26 warez sites!

  14. #14
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    Re: Licensing (Again)

    I would like to see guy who design ovi store.
    He don't know ANYTHING about app distribution on mobile phones!!

    mobile version of ovi store do the same job!
    Nothing more.

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