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  1. #1
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    Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Hi everybody,

    I am treading back to an old subject of being able to test the "Trusted" signed application status on my Series 40 device.

    Mostly, I want to put some analytics into my game in order to understand my player by understanding how they are playing in order to start working on more meaningful game updates.

    Is there anyway of testing the the trusted certificate status on my own phone game?
    I know its written on the website about getting signed would alleviate the "Ask Once" dialog shown shown to the user.
    Though, I am not really someone whose gonna take the word of what's written in the specifications, since I heard stories of even signed, it would still show the dialog.
    So, I would like to test this out on my device before proceeding further working on this subject.

  2. #2
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Quote Originally Posted by foo_mark View Post
    I know its written on the website about getting signed would alleviate the "Ask Once" dialog shown shown to the user.
    Where did you read this? I don't believe the prompts will disappear completely - you will probably find that "ask always" changes to "ask first time" as the default options, and that "always allow" becomes available (but not selected) in the list of options. Specifications for various Nokia platforms are in the wiki.

    The only way to test trusted status on the device is to sign your app with a trusted certificate - you need to spend money for this.

    Many emulators have an option for running an app with trusted status. Check the documentation for whatever you're using.

    (When I say "trusted", I mean "third-party trusted", since that's the only kind you can sign to.)

    Graham.

  3. #3
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Well, I know for a fact on the S40 FP1 (device I am currently working on), its "Ask First Time" by default.

    How many times am I allowed to sign my application if I decide to pay for it?
    From what I remember, it was pretty expensive, especially if you just want to do it for testing purposes.

    Emulators aren't worth the time, since I already have the device and I want to get an accurate behaviour from these things.

    (Yep, It can only be "3rd party trusted")

  4. #4
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Quote Originally Posted by foo_mark View Post
    Well, I know for a fact on the S40 FP1 (device I am currently working on), its "Ask First Time" by default.
    Bear in mind that this varies by device, and may vary between network operators.

    Quote Originally Posted by foo_mark View Post
    How many times am I allowed to sign my application if I decide to pay for it?
    As many as you like. Certificates have an expiry date, which is typically two years (depending on what you pay for).

    Quote Originally Posted by foo_mark View Post
    From what I remember, it was pretty expensive, especially if you just want to do it for testing purposes.
    Last time I checked, you would be looking at around €200.

    Quote Originally Posted by foo_mark View Post
    Emulators aren't worth the time, since I already have the device and I want to get an accurate behaviour from these things.
    Well, if it replicates the behaviour of the device without you having to buy a certificate, it's worth around €200.

    Graham.

  5. #5
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Quote Originally Posted by grahamhughes View Post
    Bear in mind that this varies by device, and may vary between network operators.
    Right. I've heard of that, sounds like a real pain.
    But if its signed by the hardware vendor like Nokia. It should not be a problem yes, I wouldn't have to deal with the fragmentation of permissions from network operators?

    Quote Originally Posted by grahamhughes View Post
    Well, if it replicates the behaviour of the device without you having to buy a certificate, it's worth around €200.
    Right. Does it replicate the exact behaviour of a Nokia device for this kind of thing? Have you tried it yourself?

  6. #6
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Quote Originally Posted by foo_mark View Post
    But if its signed by the hardware vendor like Nokia. It should not be a problem yes, I wouldn't have to deal with the fragmentation of permissions from network operators?
    Trusted third party is trusted third party, it doesn't matter who signs it. How the device responds is down to it's built-in policy. You can see the wiki page I linked earlier for "standard" policies of most Nokia devices, and some operator variants.

    Quote Originally Posted by foo_mark View Post
    Does it replicate the exact behaviour of a Nokia device for this kind of thing? Have you tried it yourself?
    I haven't, but S40 emulators are extremely good replicas of the actual devices. I'm not even sure if they support running an unsigned (or self-signed) app as trusted, but I recommend you explore it before spending money.

    You didn't say where you found information saying that signing would make the security prompts disappear... can you post a reference? It certainly isn't my understanding...

    Graham.

  7. #7
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Quote Originally Posted by foo_mark View Post
    Is there anyway of testing the the trusted certificate status on my own phone game?
    Hack your phone. That BeHappy certificate can be applied in three minutes, if your environment is set up. Beside that, you could use the nokiacert hack. More links and information on this page.

    I do not know what you earn in an hour. Furthermore, you can re-use that certificate still in many years, if you change the date on your device. Additionally, a real certificate open the world of Samsung, Symbian, and Ericsson. Therefore, to be honest, I would go for a VeriSign certificate, which can be ordered here …

    If you just want to learn the process of signing, then I would go for the Series 40 SDKs. Although these are named emulators, in the world of Nokia, those are real firmware and match a real device like nothing else. Some of these SDKs allow the installation of your own certificate authority.

    If you just want to learn the actual permissions, then configure the settings menu in that emulator SDKs, just point and click, nothing to sign actually. Again, that matched real devices, at least the standard product codes. There are a lot of product code variants out there with special permissions – and for those you have to use tools like NaviFirm+ and Nokia Phoenix software to test all of them. Around 10.000 variants.

    Or said differently: What you want to test, this is untestable actually.

  8. #8
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Well, I already got my answer about the phone's behavior in terms of the nag dialog the phone shows when it wants to connect to the network.

    There seems to be no way around it, even if you signed the application. I might as well make the next game fully online to give a good UX feel for the player.

  9. #9
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    For Internet access, you are able to remove that dialogue, when you sign your MIDlet and change the permission setting manually. Even without hacking. However, every user of yours has to do these steps themselves.

  10. #10
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    Quote Originally Posted by traud View Post
    For Internet access, you are able to remove that dialogue, when you sign your MIDlet and change the permission setting manually. Even without hacking. However, every user of yours has to do these steps themselves.
    Right, well you can assume most users wouldn't be so educated about these kinds of features.
    Most users would try to find to disable it via the options in the application or game if they decide to go back. That's IF they decide they want to go back.

    Most of them would not come back and just uninstall your application.
    The most important time you really want those analytics on is when your first time user trying to use your application and figure out where and what did they do within the app before deciding to quit and uninstall.

  11. #11
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    Re: Testing Enabled Trusted Certificated Status in an S40 device

    I have seen kids giving permission beforehand. Anyway, you know the alternatives now for sure. Up to you, how you decide.

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