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  1. #1
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    moderating discussions

    Is there anything wrong to create announcement that there is a new third party store for symbian device.The thread even got deleted without any notice.If nokia store still operating then it is wrong if post about third party app store but now nokia store is close what is wrong with posting about third party store here.

  2. #2
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    Re: FAQ: Content management

    The announcement was removed on basis "Advertising a competing application store", by someone from Nokia. I could reason both for and against the decision: while it is true that submitting new Symbian content to Nokia Store is not possible, it still distributes Symbian content. Also, a 3rd party store is more prone to distribute questionable content (ranging from poor quality apps to explicit malware and/or pirated apps), regardless of good intent. From this point of view I understand if Nokia does not want to propagate it.
    Last edited by wizard_hu_; 2014-03-19 at 10:41. Reason: added "Symbian" to "still distributes Symbian content", just make it more clear, perhaps

  3. #3
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    Re: FAQ: Content management

    (I moved the discussion from the original sticky thread to a new one as that topic was a bit off. )

    Wizard's points are both on the mark, and most importantly: our Store is not closed, publishers are still selling their Symbian apps through our store.

  4. #4
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    Re: moderating discussions

    Whatever the rights or wrongs, i see no evidence that a 3rd party site is more prone to poor quality, malware or piracy. What is this based on? Indeed, by not allowing updates, Nokia store apps will be more prone to security holes that can't be fixed, or poor quality due to other bugs.

    I get about 60000 downloads a month for one of my apps so yes it's still active for Symbian in that sense. However due to a change in one of the apis it relies on, which i can't update my app for, one of its main features is now broken. I don't see how trying to hide publicity of other places to download software is good for either developers or users. Whilst users can still download, it is not really open to developers in any meaningful sense - i don't think we can even update descriptions.

    They can delete the post if they want, but we shouldn't try and defame the site or pretend it's for the good of the Symbian community.

    (This isn't the first time I've seen the dubious effect of this rule - I remember when an update for one of my Symbian apps failed because my website also linked to maemo.org...)

  5. #5
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    Re: moderating discussions

    OTOH, it'll be only a small fraction of a tenth of a percent of Symbian device users that end up on these forums to find out about an alternate app store. So even if every developer republished their app in the new store, this wouldn't increase the downloads/purchases in that store by posting a link about it here (if might get a handful of developers to upload their app there, but if there's no significant traffic to the store, that doesn't do much for them).

  6. #6
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    Re: moderating discussions

    True, but then by that argument, Nokia don't have much to lose by the post being there, and relaxing the rule for Symbian

    Also I think it's still useful for developers to find out about alternative Symbian application sites - to let them know there are ways that they can still distribute and update their apps to Symbian users. Because a site where nothing can be updated, even if the store is still technically open, isn't much use for ongoing development.

  7. #7
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    Re: moderating discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by wizard_hu_ View Post
    Also, a 3rd party store is more prone to distribute questionable content (ranging from poor quality apps to explicit malware and/or pirated apps), regardless of good intent.
    Poor quality apps - ha - ha - ha Sorry, but I'd say that the quality of apps in AppList is much higher than in the Nokia Store. This here is definitely the best example (where the app name and the app icon are trademarks of different companies and beside that: 2,99 for a Guide for a game, that's even not available on the platform?):


    Quote Originally Posted by mdwh View Post
    Indeed, by not allowing updates, Nokia store apps will be more prone to security holes that can't be fixed, or poor quality due to other bugs.
    Absolutely true.

    Quote Originally Posted by mdwh View Post
    I get about 60000 downloads a month for one of my apps so yes it's still active for Symbian in that sense. However due to a change in one of the apis it relies on, which i can't update my app for, one of its main features is now broken.
    If you want to publish it in AppList, you're free to write me a PM or mail


    Besides all: I still think that any developer that is still interesting in developing Symbian apps (although you killed everything already) should be able to get a cert to sign apps with more than just self-signed on their/our own.
    Last edited by schumi1331; 2014-03-24 at 22:09.

  8. #8
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    Re: moderating discussions

    I have to just point out one thing: nobody here is degrading your website nor your apps, nor is anybody critical of your work. When Wizard pointed out the substandard quality of apps, he was merely pointing to the general tendencies of the 3rd party store(not your store) which may or may not be following the legitimate guidelines for quality assurance. So I do not see any reason to take it personally.

    That said, by general admission, your website happens to be a store which does the same business as the Nokia store and hence by policy, it would not be appropriate to promote it here.

    Thanks!!

  9. #9
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    Re: moderating discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by schumi1331 View Post
    Poor quality apps - ha - ha - ha Sorry, but I'd say that the quality of apps in AppList is much higher than in the Nokia Store.
    I said prone. Somehow you have not touched the topic of malware and pirated apps. For the gaming guide, it is obviously a rip-off, but actually it does not say anything what it is not, and I am not sure if it really abuses any trademarks.
    Besides all: I still think that any developer that is still interesting in developing Symbian apps (although you killed everything already) should be able to get a cert to sign apps with more than just self-signed on their/our own.
    This is a point where we agree.

  10. #10
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    Re: moderating discussions

    We appreciate your enthusiasm for Symbian apps, however discussions about third-party app stores are better suited outside of nokia.com sites. That is why the original thread was deleted. We hope you understand.

  11. #11
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    Re: moderating discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by Symbian_Neil View Post
    So I do not see any reason to take it personally.
    I haven't started the thread that got deleted, so I don't take that personally, don't worry

    Quote Originally Posted by wizard_hu_ View Post
    I said prone. Somehow you have not touched the topic of malware and pirated apps.
    Only free apps are there, that were released as free. Other are linked to Nokia Store. I take pirating and copyright issues serious.

    Quote Originally Posted by wizard_hu_ View Post
    This [giving certs to still active Symbian devs] is a point where we agree.
    So? We have to moderators and an admin here. Some of you are working here since years, so you can't tell me, you don't have a better contact to the people managing this than me, right? Any way to achieve this or to get a contact address to the people behind this?

  12. #12
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    Re: moderating discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by schumi1331 View Post
    I haven't started the thread that got deleted, so I don't take that personally, don't worry
    Yes, but that was said in the context that you were defending the website that hosts these apps.


    Quote Originally Posted by schumi1331 View Post
    So? We have to moderators and an admin here. Some of you are working here since years, so you can't tell me, you don't have a better contact to the people managing this than me, right? Any way to achieve this or to get a contact address to the people behind this?
    Moderators here are volunteer moderators, not Nokia Employees. nor do we gain any monetory (or similar) benefits out of this voluntary work (and yes, we dont have any more privileges than you regarding the said topic that we are discussing). We do it only out of love for community. And ofcourse you have to understand that these strategy decisions are taken by powers WAY ABOVE the people who are here.

    And if you want to contact anybody inside Nokia, you can always use 'Contact Us' which is pretty much a standard practice to any known website. But that doesnt change the fact that you cannot post your advertisement here.

  13. #13
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    Re: moderating discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by Symbian_Neil View Post
    Moderators here are volunteer moderators, not Nokia Employees. nor do we gain any monetory (or similar) benefits out of this voluntary work (and yes, we dont have any more privileges than you regarding the said topic that we are discussing).
    Oh.

    Quote Originally Posted by Symbian_Neil View Post
    And if you want to contact anybody inside Nokia, you can always use 'Contact Us' which is pretty much a standard practice to any known website. But that doesnt change the fact that you cannot post your advertisement here.
    I haven't posted any advertisement here. (but would like to close this topic here now)
    I know that I could use 'Contact Us' but that would nearly bring the same result when trying to meet Steve Jobs. Nowadays. ^^

  14. #14
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    Re: moderating discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by schumi1331 View Post
    (but would like to close this topic here now)
    Thanks schumi1331!! but we will still keep this thread open, just in case somebody else wants to pitch-in. Closing the thread would be dictatorial, which this Forum is fortunately not

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